P30 Thursday: Week Fourteen

13-Aug-09 – 23:59 by ToddG

26,737 rounds
7 stoppages, 0 malfunctions, 1 parts breakages

So the big news this week, obviously, is that we passed the 25,000 round mark! HK’s Director of Sales, Mark Osborne, volunteered to shoot #25,000 and of course we were there to record the moment:

P30-25000

The day before that photo was taken, the P30 got its 25k maintenance performed. Parts replaced were:

  • trigger return spring
  • hammer spring
  • hammer strut
  • firing pin spring
  • recoil spring & guide rod assembly

That’s it. With that, HK expects the gun to make it to 50,000 rounds. I’ve never owned a pistol that required so little in the way of upkeep. Changing the recoil spring just once every 25k … that’s unbelievable.

On the other hand, I don’t know that I’d want to be responsible for doing detailed work on the gun much more often. It is, to be blunt, difficult to take apart and put back together. Not a major problem for most users, but there are steps in the process which I swear were engineered for people with three arms. So while spending an hour or two per year performing maintenance on a pistol certainly isn’t a lot, those couple of hours can be a little frustrating.

And to be honest, that is about the only real complaint I can lodge against the pistol. I can shoot it about as well as any pistol I’ve ever used, and better than most. It has proven, at least to me, that the oft-declared need for a short reset or low bore axis simply don’t pass the smell test. Will a Glock or 1911 shooter need to practice to learn the longer reset of a P30 LEM? Yes. But lack of familiarity on their part doesn’t equal lack of capability on the gun’s part. Unless you get your kicks shooting blind “double taps” at close range to impress your buddies (or just to impress yourself), there isn’t much this gun can’t do. Earlier this week, I was consistently pulling splits in the .16’s and .17’s on Bill Drills.

The bore axis thing is a complete non-issue. Dozens of people have shot the test pistol and not a single one of them complained about excessive muzzle rise … including experienced shooters.

One thing missing from the 25,000 round report, sadly, is an accuracy test. I won’t bore you with the details, but suffice to say that there were some issues completely unrelated to the P30 itself which made doing the test as scheduled an impossibility. Hopefully, there will be a “27,000-ish round accuracy test” posted in next week’s report.

This coming week, the pistol will be in Culpeper, Virginia for an Aim Fast, Hit Fast class. If past experience is any indicator, a dozen or so people will take the P30 for a spin and we should get some smart feedback from a variety of shooters. Look forward to hearing more about that next Thursday, as well.

And finally, this week’s Gray Room picture. Who can identify this unusual HK? (and anyone who says “P30” gets banned!)

P30-gray-MPproto

Train hard & stay safe! ToddG

Previous P30 Endurance Test posts at pistol-training.com:

  1. 16 Responses to “P30 Thursday: Week Fourteen”

  2. buncha chickens, P3asdf.kf;ds err I mean hk54 (I think) prototype for the MP5?

    By Rob E on Aug 14, 2009

  3. That’s an HK2000 isn’t it? One of the SMG prototypes that never took off?

    By the_fallguy on Aug 14, 2009

  4. Definitely a UMP prototype.

    Tim

    By Timothy Slemp on Aug 14, 2009

  5. UMP Proto is my guess, as well.

    By Lane on Aug 14, 2009

  6. MP5 PIP

    By Adam G on Aug 14, 2009

  7. Adam G — Good job!

    By ToddG on Aug 14, 2009

  8. so is that a wood one? or an actual working proto?
    another question, this one about the range the pictures were taken at. It looks like the possibly a 360 degree range? or at least 270? as the wall behind Mr. Osborne looked pockmarked, or is it just the lighting?

    By Rob E on Aug 15, 2009

  9. Excellent report this week.

    Sub-gun is an MP5 PIP correct?

    By H&K 4 LIFE on Aug 15, 2009

  10. NVM- Adam got it!

    By H&K 4 LIFE on Aug 15, 2009

  11. I’m curious Adam G, did you read that on the side of the weapon or did you really know what it was?

    By Lance on Aug 16, 2009

  12. Google is my friend 😀

    By Adam G on Aug 16, 2009

  13. Could You please put a photo of the recoil spring & guide rod assembly(after 25 000 rounds)? I wonder what have left of the buffer ring. I own USC compact with a similar recoil spring & guide rod assembly. Though do not expect to shoot even 15 000 rounds anywhere soon, but curiosity has me.

    By Raja on Aug 16, 2009

  14. upon zooming I’m guessing it’s the wood one. well at least now there are better pics available of it.

    By Rob E on Aug 16, 2009

  15. Raja == I’ll snap a photo of the recoil spring guide rod assembly some time this week. The buffer was in perfectly fine shape as I recall.

    By ToddG on Aug 17, 2009

  16. Thank You Todd.

    By Raja on Aug 17, 2009

  17. I very much appreciate the HK Germanic manual of arms in their pistols–ambidextrous mag release, slide stop, decocker on rear of slide, emphasis an ergos, and recoil buffer. I am not one of those crabby the mag release is in the wrong place people. However, defending the HK trigger under the “no compromise” rubric is shaky. It has a bit of flex in the mechanism no matter what the polymer model. Cover hammer and put tension on trigger–then you’ll see. This helps contribute to the mushiness under rapid fire. The V3’s DA is too heavy–10 lbs would be excessive but its 11.4 is far too heavy. 8-9 lbs would be plenty but no. The reset to single action is not positive enough so that under stress and recoil you are not quite sure. Sure if your ToddG and can put 10k downrange at someone elses expense to master the reset then that is fine–but that’s no excuse for HK not to so better since the USP/P2000 platform has been around for over 15 years. Then after the reset in the SA mode you’re left hanging with a very light weight dead space of at least 2MM before there is any real feeling. Hence you cant really tell if you hit the reset right away after you change trigger direction. The break off point is also not defined very well and there is some overtravel. The whole trigger is imprecise and I thought german way was precision. The Sig SP2022 does much better for feel and reset in a DA/SA polymer frame; it schools the p30 V3 trigger–ah precision.

    The LEM trigger is better than the HK DA/SA. In fact I think it is the best thing going out there for design philosophy other then the Glock trigger–which could be made better–and was in the Walther “QA” action currently found in the PPS. However, the execution of the LEM in the P2000/P30 is only OK. I’ve got a LEM trigger but the major problem there is the 7.2 lbs in the V2–the only one HK is offering us Americans. The 7.2 pounds is really there at the end when you want to break the shot and at high speed it can reduce accuracy for a normal person. Maybe not for a 2.5k round per week pistol instructor. Glock got it right when they chose 6 lbs. Even Todd thinks so because he lowered his V2 to a V4 at 6.2 lbs.

    Now HK says it MAY import the V4 next year. Well their position last fall was they wont be importing the LEM at all. Gee someone was a bit wrong there. In addition they cant/wont change a V3 to a LEM variant. First off–ever heard of a frame plug. Second, there is a variant 0 on the website which seems to indicate otherwise: “P30 (V0):?Innovative safety trigger with concealed cocking piece in the spurred hammer. Centrally located de-cocking button, with a constant enhanced double action only Law Enforcement Modification (LEM)* trigger pull of approximately 4.5 pounds (20 Newtons) without operation of the de-cocking latch, and defined let-off point.” Sounds like the V3 frame could be fitted with the V@ or V4 LEM into that or the V0 nifty package. In fact that v0 trigger operation sounds very much like the Walther AS trigger (with an external hammer). Walther sees fit to allow us Americans that trigger why not HK?

    HK needs to give better and more consistent (honest) information and customer service and not have excessively long delays with excuses. HK’s cost is at the very top of polymer pistols; they need to do better. I like HK over most other options but many who own them degrade into fanboyism rather than pressuring them with fair and honest feedback to do better. Sig wallowed for many years with complacency–Todd knows. Their new head is doing much better at innovating–still not perfect but better. HK DE needs to listen to the HK USA people but one wonders if they ever will care about the civilian market or just the major govt contracts. Give us a pistol that will excel in IPSC, IDPA, or Steel Challenge etc. The stock Glocks did/do this well and proved that an agency police/combat handgun and competition gun were not mutually exclusive; I know HK can do it.

    By P30man on Aug 19, 2009

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