Comments on: Self-Inflicted GSW During AFHF

By: David Marlow

David Marlow — Sun, 13 Jun 2010 00:25:33 +0000

I know this is old, but I’m new to this site so it’s new to me.

The range I shoot at in Sierra Vista, AZ is a long way from nowhere down a road that rattles your fillings, so the “Compton Ambalamps Service” of tossing a casualty into the vehicle and getting them to the ER, which normally has great merits vs waiting for a dedicated EMS vehicle, is not a viable option.

I have an older DCU pattern MOLLE assault pack in my truck that is packed full of various implements for dealing with trauma, to include IV solutions, self-applied tourniquets, chest seal dressings, and Kerlix rolls. I packed it primarily to deal with mass casualty events such as bad car wrecks, but it will also allow for treating a wider range of injuries sustained on the range, whether it be cuts from handling steel targets and those wooden 1×2 target stands or penetrating chest wound with a punctured lung. I hope I never have to use it, though.

ToddG, great job identifying shooters with medical knowledge ahead of time. That’s something that has never even occurred to me. You never really think you might be the one who goes down I guess.

By: ToddG

ToddG — Mon, 26 Apr 2010 17:06:31 +0000

Jon -- I carry an IFAK from Tactical Medical Solutions.

By: Jon

Jon — Sat, 24 Apr 2010 02:28:18 +0000

Todd,

Can you recommend a GSW med kit for the average shooter? Thanks, enjoy the blog, keep it up.

By: ToddG

ToddG — Sat, 20 Feb 2010 18:13:41 +0000

Matt — Fair enough. The pistol was a striker-fired gun that had its trigger modified to be lighter than factory spec.

Short of having everyone clear their pistols after each iteration of each drill and shooting all exercises from Condition Four, there’s not much that could have been done from the instructor side to prevent this. As I said, I’d watched the student holster the gun properly multiple times and he’d holstered the gun probably hundreds of times already during the class. It was a momentary brain fade. It doesn’t say anything about the shooter other than that he’s a human being and fallible like the rest of us. I’d be more than happy to have him in class again in the future.

For future classes, the only real change I’ll be making is using this incident as an example of why we tell people not to race back to the holster…

By: Matt

Matt — Sat, 20 Feb 2010 17:21:31 +0000

Sorry, my question meant to read …is there anything you’ve identified as something either the training staff could do better OR was this something as simple as the student…

By: Matt

Matt — Sat, 20 Feb 2010 17:19:34 +0000

If you don’t want to identify it as X brand, could you tell us if the pistol was striker fired, DA/SA, LEM/DAK, or cocked and locked type. You mentioned the importance of taking your time returning to the holster. Was that determined to be one of the causing factors? Have you done a review and/or is there anything you’ve identified as something either the training staff could do better. Was this something as simple as the student breaking one of the cardinal rules compiled with trying to reholster fast? Sadly we all learn from peoples mistakes so the more you could share the better. Thanks.

By: ToddG

ToddG — Sat, 20 Feb 2010 13:44:44 +0000

ScottS — No question, the IFAK is not a do-it-all kit and one of the things we saw at the Memphis class was the need to treat two wounds.

FWIW, from day one I supplemented my IFAK with a combat gauze, an extra control wrap, and a chest seal. It’s not easy getting everything to fit, but it’s doable. I also tossed the casualty card stuff to make room, since my IFAK isn’t likely to be serving duty in a mass casualty event.

By: ScottS

ScottS — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 20:09:46 +0000

Todd, First time on your site… Excellent posting and something all too often neglected.
I was once the victim of a negligent discharge at the hands of another shooter, in a situation when no first aid kit was available. As a former first responder, and my personal experience, I hate to say it but I find MAJOR fault in the IFAK that you mention and recommend.First and foremost we need to think about what we are intent on using the kit for. The kit in question is designed for single use, single wound treatment. The majority of GSW that we will encounter at a range, by the pure nature of fact, are the result of close proximity shooting, in vernacular, point blank. This means that no velocity has bled off the round. If this sounds too obvious to mention please bare with me, as it is necessary to understand the types of wounds our kits are needed to treat. This high velocity GSW will almost always produce an entrance and an exit wound, as opposed to a lower velocity wound where is no “shoot through”. Relevance? There is only ONE usable dressing in the kit, and NO surgical sponges to use in addition to it to stem blood flow ( a dressing is “non-stick” and a sponge is multiple thicknesses of gauze. In addition there are no suitable dressings for thoractic wounds of the “sucking” variety. These wounds are life threatening as they allow air into the chest cavity, thereby prohibiting the diaphragm’s function of inflating the lungs. And again, minimum of two of these special purpose dressings are necessary for the obvious risk of a “shoot through injury”. And additional surgical tape and a second pair of surgical gloves are needed as in the case of a shoot through, all too often two responders are needed. In this day of life threatening blood born pathogens, I can NOT over emphasize the need of the gloves. There are people walking around carrying diseases that have not yet affected them and they, themselves are not even aware they have, so the gloves become the item of most importance, followed by some form of air barrier for thoracic wounds and doubling up on the dressings and sponges.

Sadly I am yet to find a properly outfitted individual kit anywhere, as they all are set up around “convenience and cuts” and the idea that the person next to you also has one, so the supplies are doubled. Even home and automotive as well as camping first aid kits are sorely lacking in proper supplies for any serious injuries more than 5 minutes from EMS care. With that said, I highly recommend anyone who shoots, be it at an indoor range, outdoor range, informal plinking or hunting take, not a basic first aid course but the Red Cross Advanced First Aid and Emergency Care course, as THIS is the course that will deal with the care of life threatening injuries such as gunshot wounds and penetrating thoracic wounds, of which we are the most concerned.

By: Bay

Bay — Thu, 18 Feb 2010 14:21:43 +0000

OK. Now since we have all the great advice, can you:

get into details — or answer questions — about the make and model of gun and holster type?

By: ToddG

ToddG — Wed, 17 Feb 2010 17:23:13 +0000

Guys, it was just pointed out to me that I had used “IFAC” instead of “IFAK” twice in the original post. Brain fade on my part. Mea culpa, and it has been fixed. Thanks to Jimmy S for the heads-up!