To all of the in-your-face tough guy Open Carry zealots who held Starbucks rallies such as the one pictured here, thanks.
Thanks for forcing a major, high profile international corporation into choosing between its image and yours.
Thanks for making such complete idiots of yourselves with your “Look Ma, I’ve got a gun and a coffee at the same time!” antics that what had been a nice political win for our side is now a huge media circus about how Starbucks finally said stop bringing guns into our stores.
You can croon about how you’re educating the public all you want, but it’s bullcrap. And here’s a perfect example. Did you convert the average American? No. But you scared enough soccer moms, kids, and coffee jockeys that Starbucks was forced to take action.
It was you that turned Starbucks into a political battleground. It was you that couldn’t just take the victory of Starbucks saying it would abide by local laws rather than ban guns. It was you who had to push the limits and do things utterly unacceptable among almost any normal community in the United States just so you could brag to your equally moronic Facetwit buddies. You did this. You gave the entire Second Amendment movement a huge black eye. You just educated America, all right, you educated them into believing that gun owners are a bunch of retarded monkeys who’ll throw feces the first chance they get if it’s legalized.
Do you know what would happen if you walked into the NRA Headquarter Range carrying a gun like the guys pictured above? You’d be refused entrance because they don’t allow people to walk around like that. Know what would happen if you, a stranger, walked up to my front door carrying a shotgun like this guy:
At a bare minimum you’d have a gun pointed at your face and police sirens closing in at top speed. Worst case scenario, you’d get shot dead. You know why? Because in suburban America, normal people don’t walk around carrying rifles and shotguns. Period.
Go tattoo your forehead or get your eyeballs pierced if you want to be cool & different & edgy. Stop carrying guns or talking about guns or even thinking about guns. Because you’re idiots, and you’re not helping.
(for a less angry, more in-depth intelligent read on the subject, try Sebastian at Shall Not Be Questioned)
Train hard & be smart for once in your God-forsaken life! ToddG
original rifles in front of Starbucks photo from NBC affiliate KXAN
shotgun photo from thenewcivilrightsmovement.com (edited to add: per the shotgun-wielding gentleman in the photo above via practicaltacticalpodcast.com via Tam, that particular Starbucks is in fact in Kuwait circa 2005 … so no harm no foul, buddy, but thanks for giving me a photo to riff off of)
Wow we went from a nation that was born on guns to finally being able to CC in some states with daddy’s permission. That’s your idea of progress? You do understand that gun owners make up more than half the population don’t you? If we could stop having these stupid arguments about how one should carry we could easily get all of our rights back!
Todd as a founding member and VP of Open Carry Texas don’t worry… I have plenty of pics of me floating around…
Do you not understand rights or freedoms???? You think you are a freeman hiding your gun with a state mandated “license” that “allows” you to be sneaky???? While I can OC my AR without any such restrictions??
listen to the whine ass comments about “US” claiming to starting a stir?… You mean standing up for our rights? We do not create problems… someone else dose and we deal with it and stand up for ourselves instead of sneaking around like a common criminal….
my real name is here along with my real email… if you choose to shoot me a email about this fell free to…
*feel
I don’t recall any OC group calling for boycotts and harassing customers about buying their coffee there because they allow gun owners inside! No you can thank MDA for that.
ToddG, can I ask? How are you supporting 2A rights? I mean what are you doing different that goes against the continued crackdown on guns? Do you cc? Those are rights you should have without the govt granting them to you. You allow the govt to tell you what is and what isn’t allowed. I thought our forefathers said, shall not be infringed
Id prefer we discuss how to deal with the real enemy of our born rights…. instead of bitching about your or my opinion on how to exercise em
You’re alive ’cause nobody gives a damn about you. You’re free source of a gun to any determined criminal if he decided to take it away from you. Have some integrity and admit it has happened.
Jason, I am not well versed in OC: you guys carry your long guns in ready position, stock shouldered, ready to roll, or slung on your back? ’cause I am pretty sure that in latter case you won’t have enough time to get to your AK if you’re reacting to an attack. Or you gonna draw your 23, then transition to AK, and then to Ma-Deuce?
Justin, would you write something else that has word “logic” in it?
Seriously, OC dudes, since you fight for our rights, I would appreciate if you took your fight to your enemy, so to speak, and did some OC at enemy strongholds like NYC or Chicago. That would solve my problems quick.
YK I pac mine on a single point sling…sometimes I switch around some…. usually we are at “events” with 10-50 other OC folks around… so the feared “attack” is … well slim
I keep a sig938 at about 4:30-5 oclock just in case
Once again YK your logic doesn’t make sense when everyone is armed. Are you going to rob a place that everyone inside is armed in? I think not and If you don’t see the logic in this than I can’t help you.
Time #312: No one is saying OC should be illegal. Further whining about that will be ignored. Find another website to tilt at windmills and straw men, gentlemen.
YVK: Seriously, OC dudes, since you fight for our rights, I would appreciate if you took your fight to your enemy, so to speak, and did some OC at enemy strongholds like NYC or Chicago.
I expressed mirth audibly.
It is sort of funny that all these guys claiming to be fighting the fight, proud of their rights, not needing the government to approve what they do… only OC where it’s legal to do so. 😎
YK….no one has even came close to taking a weapon from any of our guys…. but hey with 3500 members statewide and 3-4 events every weekend we really do not have too much exposure
Jason, you make a bold , and inaccurate assumption about what I carry and when I carry it. And while I may live in Oklahoma (where the summer heat is brutal), you’re not doing your side any favors by reducing this discussion to a caliber war. It misses the point. Which is people respond accordingly to that which they are presented.
In short, that means if you’re going to act like a dick, people are going to treat you like one and you don’t get to complain about it. Because you started it.
Well just sit back and wait for your rights to come back let me know how that works out for you guys. We’ll do what we think is right and you do what you think is right.
Dan, with rights come responsibilities. “Can do” is not the same as “should do”.
You’re not defending a stronghold of a freedom if you’re displaying a firearm for a sole purpose of displaying one in a place where firearm doesn’t have a use.
Todd, you condoning illegally carrying weapons?
Jason… the sheep have drank the kool-aid to long brother… no sense in trying to speak to truths and facts. They operate under permission we operate under liberty. That is their choice to make and ours to make as well. Time will show us to be right. History proves us over and over… but again… who cares about facts.
Typical liberal response YK! Joe Biden couldn’t of said it better himself!
where are you all from anyways? California? YK?… Todd??
They sound like Piers Morgan.
Justin, where is that place where everyone is armed?
My rights will slip away only after each and every independent voter who is ignorant of guns will vote blue. So when you OC guys go armed to coffee houses or malls, ask yourselves which way you’re pushing or pulling those voters.
Jason, I wasn’t talking the group parades, I was talking about when you are all by yourself.
I can assure you YK whether or not my weapon is visible it functions and serves purpose.
Jason — I think each of us needs to make decisions about how, where, and when to carry. Legality is one factor.
But when some folks trumpet their moral RKBA purity, I think it’s legitimate to ask just how legal open carry is “liberty” but legal concealed carry is “permission,” to borrow OpenCarryPreacher’s words. It’s not. It’s just a bunch of guys who want to pretend they’re edgy when they’re hiding behind the same laws they criticize the CC folks for using.
If someone wants to prove he believes his natural right to carry transcends law, he needs to demonstrate it somewhere that he isn’t protected by state law. Simple as that. Otherwise, it’s all just back patting holier than thou silliness.
That brings us right back to the broader public perception and impact. If a legal CCW’er draws no attention to himself while the legal OC’er draws negative attention that results in things like what Starbucks just did, only an idiot would pretend the OC guys are the ones who are pushing the goal posts forward in the RKBA movement.
So hiding your guns and being secretive is some how keeping that from happening?? You guys have no clue how fast this is growing in Texas and the amount of support we get from people.
Let me ask you guys, when is it that you say, enough is enough? When DHS had you at gunpoint?
YK …if I OC solo usually I am in less populated areas… we preach not to do solo walks in populated areas because of the chance of a attack. … but when solo I carry it in many configurations depending on platform and surroundings. usually on a single point in front or side.
Dan I have been
at gunpoint by DHS
Idiots, add the author stated. The idiot is the one that the govt tramples all your rights while you say back and watched it happen
some of our guys were also the other day…..http://www.infowars.com/dhs-detains-oathkeepers-heading-to-gun-rally/
Dan I was at gunpoint because DHS was illegally detaining me and demanding I ID to them….. that’s a fight you would never understand because you would of shivered down and complied to your master..
Best way to educate public and remove negative stigma from guns is to introduce them to guns! I have had zero issues while open carrying and I have answered lots of questions to people who just didn’t know what the laws are. Some of our members have gone to jail so to say we aren’t taking a risk is not true because not all cops know that we are well within our rights! No one is scared of us when we carry only curious and our group only grows every event! So we have lots of evidence to support what we are doing is making people less scared of law abiding citizens with guns! As far as MDA they hate us I can’t help that and guess what they hate you too. We will continue to educate people about the laws and making people less afraid!
u say Idiot … I say patriot
I say sheep… you say law abiding citizen
Justin — Best way to educate public and remove negative stigma from guns is to introduce them to guns!
That’s as stupid as the gay rights movement saying the best way to introduce the public to homosexuality is to have gay sex in public, or NAMBLA saying they should have a big public child molestation parade.
You don’t get to decide how other people respond to what you do, and the Starbucks incident is a pretty clear example that the net effect is negative.
Jason — I say sheep… you say law abiding citizen
So if I don’t go beyond what’s legal and that makes me a sheep, what illegal actions do you advocate? Which ones have you personally engaged in? If you really are a patriot who isn’t bound by illegal restrictions on the RKBA, go to NYC or Chicago and open carry there for a few days. If you’re not willing to do that, you’ll have to admit that you’re no more willing to stand up for yourself than I am.
Todd it is legal for us to OC our rifles in TX.
If it makes you feel better……we were told by San Antonio Chief that We would not be allowed to open carry in SA…….so we got this event coming …
https://www.facebook.com/events/159181827620253/
talk some more chit…..
Jason — Under Texas law, are you allowed to open carry your rifles in San Antonio?
People have a choice ToddG when people see that we are just ordinary Joe’s just like them they come up and ask question’s no one force’s them to. Is you hiding in your room polishing your guns doing anything at all to remove the stigma?
a little more history about “US” fighting for rights:
http://opencarrytexas.wordpress.com/2013/08/08/mccallen-texas-call-to-action/
http://opencarrytexas.wordpress.com/2013/07/30/ft-worth-pd-willing-to-violate-your-right-to-carry/
http://opencarrytexas.wordpress.com/2013/09/15/the-elephant-in-the-room/
http://opencarrytexas.wordpress.com/2013/09/18/statement-on-starbucks-ceo-comments-regarding-guns/
that should get you started understanding….
Justin — Is you hiding in your room polishing your guns…
You are so talking to the wrong guy.
Yes we are Todd… but the chief of police and the City Council don’t think Texas law applies in SA…
Justin — Best way to educate public and remove negative stigma from guns is to introduce them to guns!
That’s as stupid as the gay rights movement saying the best way to introduce the public to homosexuality is to have gay sex in public, or NAMBLA saying they should have a big public child molestation parade
Am I???
Todd the Chief of Police in Ft. worth thought the TX law didn’t apply there either….we got that fixed real quick already
Jason — Then basically what you’re doing in your big show of patriotism and non-sheepishness is… relying on state law to grant you permission to do what you want to do. So sorry, no, that’s not any different than what I do when I carry concealed on my permit.
Again: unless you do something illegal, you’re obeying the law just like the rest of us and you’re no more patriotic for it.
We are gaining support to change the laws! ToddG it takes more than one tough guy writing a BS article while hiding in his room polishing his gun to change laws! We are gaining speed and numbers and we will change the laws in Texas so that we can carry however we please without paying a tax and asking permission to do so!
And remember we aren’t the ones who started attacking people on the right side of this you were!
the state law dose not grant us any permission to OC long guns…… they are unregulated unlike handgun and unlike licensed ccw handguns…..
still you have emotional fiction… your a tough one to break
We have members running for several political positions and we apply lots of pressure to our representatives we currently have! We understand how this works and we are organized!
Our LGs are un-regulated in TX… we are riding on our born rights protected under the 2A bro
Give up Todd. You’re arguing with the very same feces-throwing monkeys that caused this mess to begin with. They’re never going to see your point. They’ll just keep pissing all over everything and mucking it up for the rest of us.
Starbucks wanted to be left out of the agenda pushing jackassery. They were happy to leave people alone until OC activist assholes refused to leave them alone. They took a libertarian approach of live and let live. But the OC activists made them an unwilling soapbox. Pro-gunners did this. Fact.
Jason — If there is no law against it, then there is no law against it. Pretending that amounts to “fighting the power” is the real emotional fiction here.
It’s 3am for me and I’m going to sleep. You guys talk amongst yourselves.
Justin, read what Todd wrote carefully, and hold your desire to type a response for a few minutes.
The best way to introduce anything to anybody and remove stigma is to induce a curious and positive response. You have to be very accurate in assessing your impact. Last year an OC went into local mall carrying AR. I never engaged anybody into discussion, only listened what people said – gym, work, stores. 100% negative, in a state that’s I believe is considered more gun friendly than Texas.
So next time you do your rally, count not the people who come and ask, but those who briskly walk away.
Jason, I find it illuminating that you preach against solo OC because of chance of attack, in your words.Seems like an admission that OC is not that great idea from “tactical” standpoint?
YK don’t put words in my mouth…… not every member holds training needed to deal with a attack. so as a disclaimer we suggest everybody go in groups…. durrr