Another “I was at the range last night and…” report:
Guy #1 is someone I’ve seen at the range literally a dozen times and who has asked me repeatedly for advice and tips. My advice has always been to take a private lesson from any of the two dozen instructors whose business cards are on the range bulletin board. But every time I see Guy #1, he has instead bought a new pistol that he is convinced will be The One Ring. And after telling me how it’s completely transformed him as a shooter (for the seventh time in four months), he again asks if I could stop my practice session to give him a half hour of free help to overcome all the same exact problems he’s had since the first time I saw him. He’s too good (in his mind) to pay for instruction — I don’t even teach private lessons! — but feels entitled to devour other shooters’ range time with his problems.
Guy #2 is an NRA instructor who was giving lessons to new shooters, and doing a very professional job from what I could tell from one lane over. At one point, without interrupting anything I was doing, he quickly popped his head around the corner of the booth and asked for my business card. Right there in front of his students, he asked for another instructor’s business card. No ego, no embarrassment, no need for a twenty minute discussion about his family and the first time he ever fired a gun and how super-nifty-awesome his new Zippy Shotmaster 4000 is compared to a Glock, etc.
The next time Guy #1 talks to me, I’m going to tell him to call Guy #2. Guy #2 has a lot he could teach Guy #1, and not all of it is related to pistol technique.
Train hard & stay safe! ToddG
Hmmm – do you think he’ll find his way over to this site to learn a few things?
I must say though, Todd – it’s hard not to notice the halo of smoke coming from your lane! (It’s also easy to see how serious folks are by the type of targets they’re putting up and what they’re doing when the carrier stops downrange.) Big egos and professionalism in a learning environment don’t coexist all that well. It’s a true hallmark of a great teacher when they demonstrate grace and depth of knowledge without making the lesson all about themselves.
Thank you for taking the time to let me try out the HKs and I’m looking forward to the AFHF class next month.
Cheers,
Pk
This story illustrates a broad problem in the shooting community. Most people do not see the value in training. People like tangible things. New gear and guns is cool. New knowledge picked up at a course is not so cool. Most men have the attitude that they already know how to “shoot” even if they have had no training or education in the subject whatsoever. Not only are they reluctant to ask for advice (many of us are), but they believe that they honestly know how to shoot well already.
That’s awesome. I’ve seen both those type of guys more than a few times. I would like to think these days I’m more like guy #2, but no doubt in the past I think at one point I was similar to someone like guy #1 before I started to really learn anything.
That said, It’s cool you touched on this, I’ve been looking at where or what kind of training I want to spend some time and money on, and sadly the thing is, I’m worried about guy #3… Super-tactical-fragalistic training at $500 a day from some guy who’s maybe friends with an actual shooter, but since he probably shoots at least a 100 rounds per month and is so good that his job is really more about telling newbies how to hold their shitty gun wrong (this guy usually carries an $5000 1911, anything less sucks of course), and getting them to pre-register for the $1000 a day “Tactical-fragelistic carbine class” that’s coming up next month…
Thanks to sites like this one, I’ve been better off spending my money on ammo then with guy #3… hope to attend one of your classes or one with one of the better instructors at some point if life cooperates (wife, kids, job, and geography allowing…).
Next time guy #1 bothers you, IMO you should just tell him to check out the site and leave you alone.
I will fully admit to being a bit of a mix of the two. I can shoot rifle and shotguns well. I can’t hit shit with a handgun. I keep buying new handguns trying to find something that works better. I know I should just take the money I was going to spend on a pistol to take some training, I even took a NRA basic pistol marksmanship class to do just that, but as much as I’m a shooter I’m a collector so the lure of the next gun is often too much to pass up.
That being said there is no training in my area. I think the nearest thing would be to drive to NOVA but then once you factor in hotel costs it’s often a dauntingly large sum of money.
My first time at the range, I called ahead to schedule time with a trainer. Once the range officer understood that I had never shot a pistol before he told me to show up early on a Tuesday and he would give me the basics.
He helped more than I can say. Thanks to that R.O. and sites like this, I’ve learned that proper training is as important and buying the right pistol.
Great Post!
I’m so glad that though I once was Guy#1, always asking these so-called “instructors” for free advice in their off hours, I have now purchased a gently used Lorcin 9mm and am on my way to handgun nirvana. The young man who sold me this jewel also threw in a free DVD player, 4 packs of KOOL’s, and an 8 track of Neil Sedaka’s Greatest Hits. Todd, I just have a few quick questions regarding the tiny crack in the slide, and the proper technique required to point the gun “gangsta style”… I’ll call you tonight during dinner and we can discuss.
When I began training to get my private pilot’s license, I felt I had entered an elite community make up of special people of superior intelligence and endowed with the virtues I admired. The more time I spent among this community the more I recognized it had its share of boors in similar proportion to the general population.
When I began training in handgun shooting to get my CCW license, I felt I had entered an elite community…
An so it goes.
I always thought it was the guns fault and not mine in the early days (didn’t help that buddies were messing with my sights whenever they could) but I never bothered anyone else over it. Too much ego to lower myself to do that. Then I met someone who COULD shoot quite well (Mike Christensen up there on the FAST wall of fame), he kindly offered to help me out and I learned the value of instruction. One can always learn more.
i am an elite team fighter; here’s my card…
I’ve been to two training classes, one local with a visiting instructor, the other at a major school in AZ. Both times I felt like I had walked in on a private party. Most, if not all of the other students had been to multiple classes with the visiting instructor or had attended the AZ school many times as they were locals.
That’s my perspective on why people don’t seek out training – bad prior experiences. I haven’t picked up a gun since the last class in August of 2009.
I know what you mean EricW. Sorry to hear that bad experience. When I lay down big money for training $200+ and when its lame I kick myself: “What was I thinking?” and “I’ll never do that again” can be heard in the car ride home. One issue Todd doesnt really address (because like in every “industry” he cant make too many waves criticizing the “marginal”) is the fact that too many instructors are paid much too much money for their skill level. There are guys who want $200 per person per day (which starts in earnest at 9:30am takes an hour for lunch and stops at 3:30pm) who need to go on a permanent vacation or lower those rates by 2/3’s. Demand for firearms training went much higher after 9/11 and there are a lot of mediocre firearms instructors out there who suddenly were flush with students and their rates went skyhigh–kind of like the gun and ammo craze of 2008-10 or mortgage loan officer/realtor craze of 2004-2007. $200 per person per day has become the rack rate to many instructors minds. I think at least 50% of the “instructors” out there arent worth even 1/3 that money per person day. Lets put that in statement in perspective. An EMT would wet themselves to make $200*15 = $3000 per day; an EMT is a much harder job with much more education required than a basic NRA basic pistol and home defense instructor certs. Buyer’s of training should be very very skeptical and seek out those with the best credibility. I would recommend starting your study with some of the excellent videos and books out there–go to brian enos site for some good suggestions. BTW I have a guy who charges less than $40 an hour for PERSONAL one on one hourly instruction (and no I wont give you the guys name in case he’s giving me a deal–but I dont think so). At $40/hr even with “only” one student that is $80,000 per year if you bill 40 hours a week. That is good money for doing something you love to do. The mediocre guys are put to shame by this guy who is very highly qualified. Also relatively “famous” people like Larry Vickers and Matt Burkett are not rip off artists–last I checked were basically charging that $200 ppd rack rate. I dont know where in AZ you are but see who the people at RIO Salado (riosaladosportsmans.com) might suggest.
It is a fact that a lot of the people in the “industry” got their training paid for by the taxpayer or had generous people at the range (what one might describe as the “gun culture”) school them over time. Now many of these people are trying to monetize that experience instead of passing it on. Well if you are really good at what you do then ok. But if you arent then shame on you. I havent taken a class with todd–but I’ll report back if he’s worth the dough (;-)).
P30 – Agree. You can attend Blackwater for $200 per day. Believe me, they are worth every penny. My question is who would pay a yahoo……
P30man — The error in your math is the assumption that someone is getting 40 hours of 1-on-1 $40/hr instruction per week. Most instructors don’t teach 40hr/wk, 50wk/yr. Traveling to and from another city and staying there for 3-4 nights (plus meals, car, etc.) isn’t free. Range rental isn’t free. Targets aren’t free. Etc. Someone who is teaching two classes a month and wants to keep class size reasonable either charges enough to make it profitable, or he finds another career.
P30man hit on a huge problem, one that has another side to it. I have had some very good training from some very competent people, and have taken that training, along with a small fortune in ammo, and turned it into a pretty good level of proficiency. In addition to being able to shoot, I am a good coach and instructor, but that isn’t my profession. I’m a military policeman and I shoot on my own every chance I get, usually two or more times per week. I shoot action pistol stages with a group of people every other Sunday, and if I see a glaring problem with someone’s technique (inconsistent grip, shooting cadence way too fast for their ability to control it, obvious things like that), I will sometimes offer them a bit of advice off to the side so as not to embarrass anyone. Most of the time I end up with a blank look, a few nods, then they keep it up. I think the perception is there that if you aren’t a paid instructor or regular contributor to one of the national gun magazines, then you must not be worth listening to. Unfortunately, those of us who were trained with taxpayer dollars sometimes try to pass that on with negative results.